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First time database migration - any advice?

  • 1.  First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 11-27-2023 11:01 AM

    Hello AASP Community,

    My organization is considering switching from our highly customized Salesforce instance (pre-NPSP) to the Blackbaud Raisers Edge. I am wondering if anyone would be willing to speak with me and my team about your advice and pro's and con's to Blackbaud. Our directive is to make the decision by the end of December, so if anyone can speak with us in the next two weeks I would really appreciate it!

    Some of the things we are considering:

    Our Salesforce instance:

    Pros: highly customized to our unique circumstances, has grown with our organization as we got more complex, anything you can dream you can do

    Cons: in use for 15 years, has a lot of tech debt (archaic fields, reporting, etc.), was not built specifically for fundraising, so we have to build out all of the features we want, such as moves management/ engagement processes. 

    Thank you!

    ~Leslie

    @Zoe Carr



    ------------------------------
    Leslie Proudfoot
    GRID Alternatives
    lproudfoot@gridalternatives.org
    ------------------------------


  • 2.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 11-27-2023 12:46 PM
    Leslie, it's hard to think of a bigger shift in culture and capabilities than moving from custom SF to Raiser's Edge. In general, RE is not very good at sharing data with other systems, neither through back-end integration nor through web connections. It has a really steep learning curve for database view users, and most querying gets handled by specialists. While it has a lot of structure and function that is designed for fundraising, it's also pretty inflexible. If you don't want to do things the way RE wants to, particularly in areas like pledging and matching gifts, it can be really painful. And there's a huge difference between how RE generates reporting versus SF. The RE style of querying and reporting is very old-school, and not suited to on-the-fly query construction or exploration of data. There are MANY quirks to RE's data model. Larger institutions tend to invest in data warehousing to be able to use PowerBI or other reporting tools instead of relying only on RE's internal reporting engine. RE is lacking in workflow automation capabilities. What little it has is underpowered, and while you can improve on its native capabilities using Power Automate, it's still quite limited compared to Salesforce. I'm sure I'm missing some other differences, but hopefully this is a reasonable start. In the last 5+ years, we have yet to encounter a client who was using SF and whom we advised to switch to RE. There are alternatives to SF that you could consider, or you could re-implement SF, and those options might be superior to moving to RE NXT. However, it would take a needs analysis to reach a meaningful position on that question.


    Thank you,
    Isaac Shalev
    Data Strategy Expert
    Sage70, Inc.
    (917) 859-0151
    isaac@sage70.com

    Schedule a 30-minute consultation now:




    Original Message


  • 3.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 11-27-2023 12:52 PM

    Hi Isaac,

    Thanks so much for that response, I really appreciate it. Just to be clear, does your message refer to the newest version of Blackbaud, i.e. NXT?

    Could you elaborate on this: "The RE style of querying and reporting is very old-school, and not suited to on-the-fly query construction or exploration of data. There are MANY quirks to RE's data model. Larger institutions tend to invest in data warehousing to be able to use PowerBI or other reporting tools instead of relying only on RE's internal reporting engine. " 

    ~Leslie



    ------------------------------
    Leslie Proudfoot
    GRID Alternatives
    lproudfoot@gridalternatives.org
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 11-27-2023 12:55 PM

    While it's been about 10 years since I've used Salesforce, I agree with Isaac. I think moving to Raiser's Edge would be a step in the wrong direction. We currently use RE and have to report out of our data warehouse via Tableau. The lack of automation and ability to customize definitely hinders our team.

     

    Shelby Tudor

    Director, Gift Administration

    Office: 301-565-8463

    Cell: 757-672-3160

     

    **General notice: Although you may receive this email after work hours or while out of office, please understand that I have no expectation you will read or reply to emails during your personal time.

     




    Original Message


  • 5.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 11-27-2023 01:08 PM
    To be fair, many institutions that are using Salesforce are also/still using separate warehouses for reporting, processing, etc.

    Matt Heimbach
    Executive Director, Advancement Information & Technology
    Advancement Services
    NC State University
    919-513-1940





    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 11-27-2023 01:25 PM
    That is exactly what I was going to say. I cannot think of any solution used by my clients - including four different Salesforce applications - where some alternative reporting solution is being used. That's in addition to whatever "built-in" functionality that exists.

    Reporting should never be the reason for changing CRMs. I cannot tell you how often that is used as the argument: "We can't get the data out of the system!" Well, there are other problems. Typically, the solution is not being used correctly or key data elements are not being put into the best reporting fields.

    I cannot say that moving to NXT is moving in the "wrong direction." NXT is often a better choice for some institutions. However, if you have already transitioned to a Salesforce application - a typically easier platform for reporting and end-user queries and dashboards - I'd first look at why your solution isn't working. And you already answered that question - you have substantially customized your instance.

    Well, if you go to NXT you are going to have your hands full undoing all your customization anyway! So, you should look at the 3 or 4 standard SF solutions that exist today and move in that direction. Ensuring, of course, that you leave your customization behind!

    John

    John H. Taylor
    Principal
    John H. Taylor Consulting, LLC
    2604 Sevier St.
    Durham, NC   27705
    919.816.5903 (cell/text)

    Serving the Advancement Community Since 1987





    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 11-27-2023 03:09 PM
    As others may have said, this would be an unusual migration path. A better path is probably looking at salesforce-built solutions like UC Innovation.  I think you would be disappointed in the limited automations and flexibility of the platform. On top of it, in order to do work, your users would be using the web for you and your power users would be using the database View or the desktop view.  That being said, salesforce can be a beast, and RE may be a bit more simple to grasp. -too simplistic and inflexible for some.  It is definitely easier to get data out of Salesforce, especially taking advantage of a number of new features put out in the last year or so, but I have never found it hard to get data out of RE in either database view or webview.  

    The big question that you really need to be asking though is how are your fundraisers going to react to this? If the move isn't being driven by them, they at least need to be involved and on board with it.  I would also strongly recommend procuring an expert to guide you through the migration process.  They will be aware of questions to ask that you likely cannot conceive of.  




    Dave Woodley 
    Chief Data Officer
    Unlock * Share * Connect
    Office of Data Services
    University of Alaska Foundation
    907-786-1373
    make a gift! engage.alaska.edu
    Join us for Alaska: universityforalaska.com




    Original Message


  • 8.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 11-27-2023 04:49 PM
    Leslie, yes, I'm referring to NXT, which as far as I know is the only commercially available version you can get from BB today. To expand some on my comments about reporting:
    • The RE querying wizard with its 4-step tabs of Criteria, Output, Sort and Results is linear and procedural. It is meant to support the use-case of a data analyst who has already designed their data request and is now plugging it into the system. It is not intended for data exploration - for running a query, then adjusting it, then rerunning it, then sorting the results differently from the output screen, etc. The design of the wizard isn't intuitive, either -- you don't see a preview of your query results as you build, so you have to visualize it all in your head before you run it. If your query is particularly complex or 'heavy', running and re-running isn't an effective strategy
    • Quirks of RE's data model, query engine, etc. are many. Webview and DB view don't always sync reliably or as expected. Some types of records can be changed via global changes, while others, eg Proposals, need to be changed by creating a query, exporting the relevant proposals, changing the data in Excel and then importing the file. Language between Web and DB is not consistent. There are all sorts of quirks - a really good way to get a sense for them is to have a  look at https://community.blackbaud.com/products/raisersedgenxt/ideas - which is mostly a list of ideas for fixing oddities or closing gaps in functionality. 
    • Regarding the data warehousing, it's true that warehousing is a great approach for data analysis irrespective of the underlying system, be it SF or RE. If you already use data warehouses and your advancement team has the right skillset on board this may be a smaller issue -- though you'll still need to deal with how to keep your warehouse in sync with RE, which is a bigger hasle than with other systems. 
    NXT has lots of positives, and we do sometimes recommend it to our clients, so please don't read this as a takedown. It's a little bit of informed tour-guiding through some of the rough spots of a powerful and capable fundraising database. 




    Thank you,
    Isaac Shalev
    Data Strategy Expert
    Sage70, Inc.
    (917) 859-0151
    isaac@sage70.com

    Schedule a 30-minute consultation now:





    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 12-18-2023 01:32 PM

    Hello everyone,

    Thank you so much for that input. It's really valuable to hear from other professionals about their experience with similar situations.

    Some of the points I've found most valuable to consider:

    • RE NXT is not customizable like Salesforce, has limitations and quirks, and reporting is not very intuitive and usually must be handled by experts
    • Alternatives include migrating to one of Salesforce's pre built systems like NPSP or re-implementing our Salesforce (our programs + fundraising are integrated currently)
    • The Blackbaud Ideas Community shares some of the limitations which users want to be fixed, which gave me a good under-the-hood look at the system since I have never used it myself before https://community.blackbaud.com/products/raisersedgenxt/ideas 
    • We should strongly consider hiring an expert to help guide us through this data migration
    • and
    • We need to include our users and make sure they are on board with such a major decision

    Wish me luck with this process, and thank you!
    Leslie



    ------------------------------
    Leslie Proudfoot
    GRID Alternatives
    lproudfoot@gridalternatives.org
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 10.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 12-01-2023 07:28 AM

    Hi Leslie,

    I agree with everything others have said. Switching from a SalesForce based system feels like a step back. You'll go from a very flexible system to one that locks you down, forcing you to be creative with how you store data. 

    If it isn't too late, you might consider Slate. I'm in my second conversion to Slate, one from RE at Northfield Mount Hermon and now one from Advance at Williams College. Slate is a great and flexible system. I can't say enough about it.

    Victor



    ------------------------------
    Victor Nuovo
    Williams College
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 11.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 12-04-2023 10:36 AM

    Hello everyone,

    Wow, the AASP community has really come through for us! We have gotten some great insights on Raiser's Edge and Blackbaud in general, why a database migration might or might not be a good idea, and also some really good insights about how to make a database migration successful if we do go through with it. 

    I've talked with a number of folks who have used Blackbaud. Would anyone be willing to speak with me about Salesforce Nonprofit Success Pack? Since we use Salesforce pre-NPSP I would love to learn more about how NPSP actually functions.

    Thanks again,

    Leslie



    ------------------------------
    Leslie Proudfoot
    GRID Alternatives
    lproudfoot@gridalternatives.org
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 12.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 12-04-2023 10:58 AM
    Leslie,

    I would be happy to talk about our migration from Raiser's Edge to NPSP.

    Monica
    Monica Solomon  |  Director of Development Operations   
    The Morton Arboretum  |  4100 Illinois Route 53  |  Lisle, Illinois 60532
    T 630-725-2048   F  630-719-2421 |  msolomon@mortonarb.org  











    Original Message


  • 13.  RE: First time database migration - any advice?

    Posted 12-04-2023 01:09 PM

    You're probably aware of this, but Salesforce has very recently released Nonprofit Cloud, a separate product from NPSP, that is intended as providing closer integration with other Salesforce components, among other things.  Apparently, Nonprofit Cloud is a alternative to NPSP, but cannot be installed in the same organization as NPSP.

     

    My US$0.02 worth; the usual disclaimers apply.

     

    Good luck!

    Alan

     

    Alan S. Hejnal (he/him)

    Data Quality Manager

     

    SNAGHTML5cbfa34

     




    Original Message


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